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by WaitWaitWha·5y ago·view on hn ↗
Interesting reference to adulthood.

> ... The moment you graduated from a pencil or ballpoint, to a pen you knew you were no longer a child ...

When I was growing up, we started with pencil, moved to fountain pens (the one with the cartridges & tiny glass balls), then graduated to ballpoint.

A cultural difference.

3 comments
We use goose quills in the UK. No we don't! I'm 50ish and I started with a pencil and moved up to a variety of pens later.

My prep school (that's a UK private school for 13-16) encouraged pretty much anything that made a neat mark on the page. The Head who later retired to Bursar was a massive fan of fibre tips - less blotting I suppose - how progressive. I should point out that corporal punishment (ie cane/belt/backboard rubber) was still legal back then, not so progressive 8) Everyone had a fountain pen or two. Generally cartridge type but some used a bladder sucker type and a bottle of Quink because it was much cheaper. We used a lot of pink blotting paper.

At Rheindahlen infant school, I think we used chalk (it was pencil.) Paderborner First - probably a chisel on stone (pencil.) Those are BFES (UK military) schools and yes it was all a bit bewildering for a young child. Before 13, I went to those and Button Lane infant school in Manchester, not to mention "Jerboa" School in Soltau. I may have missed one or two out.

"We use goose quills in the UK."

Perhaps you should—perhaps we all should—when learning. The best handwriting I've ever seen was written with them. ;-)

"<...>school for 13-16) encouraged pretty much anything that made a neat mark on the page."

As I mentioned earlier, when I was first taught to write there was no option other than a steel-nibbed pen that we dipped into inkwells (pencils were first but only in infants' class (6 or so) and we basically only drew pictures with them). Well-behaved boys (teachers never ask girls) were chosen to mix up packets of powered ink with water. Budding young chemists like me had a ball of a time, we were excused from class to a sink near the corridor. Sometimes ink went everywhere including all over us.

By 13-16 we too could use just any writing implement we wanted (presumably by then we were supposed to know what to do). Not that you'd know it, a teacher once likened my handwriting to Chinese hieroglyphics done by the wanderings of a demented spider (I'm sure that line was was wheeled out every year for especially 'problematic' kids like me.)

Incidentally, I recall that on a few occasions we were given quills during our art class period to try out and they worked very well but they didn't stay 'sharp' very long (BTW, we used the ink in our normal inkwells to write with). We were shown how to cut and prepare them, this we did with single-sided GEM razor blades. I reckon today if a teacher gave 7 - 8 year olds razor blades to play with it'd be deemed child abuse.

My-my, how things have changed.

That's surprising for me - my memory of it was that ball points were just plain safer as a 3rd / 4th grade kid using them.

Fountain pens on the other hand were expensive, messy (they can leak in your pocket, you have to refill them with ink, the nibs might need replacing) and just plain hard to use in general.

I think I got my first fountain pen in high school - one of those landmark dad / son moment along with things like learning how to shave etc.

I grew up in the US in the 90s and 00s, and I only used pencils and ballpoint pens. I've never used a fountain pen, I don't even think I've seen one outside of a display case of a fancy pen shop.

I'm also pretty sure I can now only write a paragraph or two before my hand starts cramping up.

> I'm also pretty sure I can now only write a paragraph or two before my hand starts cramping up.

This was actually a nice thing about picking up a fountain pen to write with. The ink flows without you applying pressure (or significant pressure) to the page, and you learn to let the pen mostly rest in place in your hand. If you're gripping it tightly, you're probably holding it wrong. I've written dozens of pages at a time with a fountain pen and never felt much hand strain, in contrast to how I often felt with other pens and pencils. Though since learning to hold a pen properly with the fountain pen, I've become better with those as well

Except for cheap ballpoints, they suck.

I’m about 3 years into an experiment in which I try to determine if fountain pens can reduce waste and be less expensive overall. This is the first time I’ve ever used fountain pens and am finding that success is likely, with the side effect of increased writing enjoyment. I bought a Lamy Safari and a Pilot Metropolitan with refillable tanks. These are “cheap” pens.

Funny thing - I once was cleaning one of the pens in the sink at work and a colleague noticed, and happily told me of his happy memories with fountains pens growing up in India. There were a few others in the room who heard and started a conversation about childhood, school, and especially the anxiety of school exams with their fountain pens. It was a real treat.

" I bought a Lamy Safari and a Pilot Metropolitan with refillable tanks. These are “cheap” pens."

I wouldn't let that worry you for an instant, that is unless you want one that's very pretty or just damn pretentious (i.e.: a wanky talking point) like my Montblanc (I got it super cheap and duty free). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meisterst%C3%BCck. Like watches, you pay heaps and heaps just for the styling (they don't necessarily write better).

That said, I prefer both my Parker and Waterman to the Montblanc as I prefer to write with them, especially the Waterman. Moreover the damn Montblanc leaks when taken on planes—having ink dripping down one's shirt in the middle of a flight is a real pain. Nevertheless, keep in mind that refillable tanks are the best as you can select and match inks to suit but they are more likely to leak than a pre-filled cartridge when on a flight.

I don't have a Lamy at the moment but I've had them in the past and they're really pretty good pens. Irrespective, of which pen you have, it's important that the nib you have suits your writing style (it's worth trying various types out if you haven't done so already).

To your point of reducing waste, Pilot cartridges are refillable - you just need to tweeze out the little plastic biscuit, and later push it back into the refilled cartridge with the back of a chopstick or something.

I refill from Iroshizuku bottles, having found inks designed for Western pens to tend to flow poorly in Pilot F and EF nibs - a shame; I really like Herbin inks. For the actual filling, I use an adjustable automatic pipetter that I got for $30 off Amazon, before I quit doing business with them, and which can anyway be found more cheaply on eBay; the cartridges take about a milliliter, so get one whose range includes that volume. (I fill mine to 950ul, but it's not super critical.) If you haven't used a pipetter before, read the instructions carefully and practice with water first, since misuse can potentially damage the tool. But you'll get the hang of it pretty quick, and it's a lot faster and neater than syringes and dispensing needles. The tips are meant to be disposable, and it's good to have a few spares on hand in case of inadvertent bumps damaging the very fine dispensing orifice, but you can also just flush well with water after use and keep using the same tip for a long time.

Another problem is holding cartridges for refilling. I made a six-gang rack a couple years ago, but before that had reasonable results with a clothespin at the bottom of the cartridge and a bit of masking tape to keep the clothespin in place on my desk - slow, but workable.

I don't even know the last time I had to throw out a cartridge. They can crack if you have the bad habit of squeezing to push ink from a newly installed cartridge into a dry feed, so don't do that; otherwise, I've found them to hold up really well.

I appreciate your response! I am also using the same Iroshizuku bottle in both the Pilot and Lamy pens.

I'm curious about the Pilot cartridges - why do you need to replace the "little plastic biscuit"? Does it serve a purpose other than preventing spills or evaporation in unused cartridges?

No, I mean, it's just a mechanical seal, not required for the pen to function; the cartridge friction-fits the same way on the stem of the feed whether the seal is there or not.

That said, I'd still say it's worth keeping track of the seals, just so that you're not out of luck if you do find a use case that requires a sealed cartridge - carrying a couple of spares in a work bag, for example, as I do. The best way I know to keep track of them is by reinstalling them in freshly filled cartridges, but I guess I'd do that anyway since I refill in batches rather than by the each. It is a fiddly task, so I could see skipping it if it wouldn't be needed.

Side note: If you're always going to be filling and using cartridges by the each, a Pilot CON-40 or Lamy Z28 converter will likely be more convenient; these offer an inexpensive alternative to cartridges, and use a screw-piston mechanism to let you fill the pen directly from a bottle of ink - see [1] for examples and details of use. I've found converters inconvenient and messy to use, hence the preference for cartridge refilling, but they might well serve you better than refilling with even less potential waste.

(Reviewing your prior comment, I note you have a Metropolitan, which should have shipped with a press plate converter. That's definitely one to try! The page linked at [1] has info on how to use it, including how to get past the pitfalls I ran into when I tried the one that came with my first pen. Goulet says it has a higher capacity than the CON-40, too, at 0.9ml vs. 0.6ml for the CON-40. [2] [3])

[1] https://www.jetpens.com/blog/how-to-use-a-fountain-pen-conve...

[2] https://blog.gouletpens.com/2013/08/pilot-converter-ink-capa...

[3] https://www.gouletpens.com/products/pilot-con-40-piston-conv...

I had that problem before I started using fountain pens. Now I can write pages at a time in my diary like it's nothing. The Pilot Metropolitan is a really good pen and you can get one for $20, maybe it's worth a try!
In my country it generally works the same (as writing with fountain pen is enfoced in primary schools), but after "ballpoint" phase during college some people go back to fountain pens, as they are seen as more classy and elegent writing tool.
Which country is that?

My experience, and that of my kids (in USA) is that pencil is used through high school for daily work. When I was in school, final drafts of essays or other papers could be in ink or typed. Math and science was always done in pencil. Today, pretty much everything written is submitted by computer. Kids can barely print legibly, forget about cursive writing or any care for penmanship.

Pencils are not valid for most (all?) exams in the kindof high school I went to and definitely not valid in university exams (in Austria). It's just too easy to fake afterwards
This is what I see in Germany. A few people stuck with fountain pens thorough high school, but I think moist people switched to ballpoint or fineliners. I don't have a particularly nice handwriting, and a fountain pen would not help with that. So it's not worth the fuss.