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by mark_l_watson·6mo ago·view on hn ↗
The forced US hosted tik-tok sale is all about hiding information from the US public that most people in the rest of the world have easy access to.
16 comments
It isn't so much as the rest of the world having easy access. It is what the Chinese want the rest of the world to see. If you are in a South American country using a residential IP in new incognito session, doom scroll, after the initial disturbing content, you will start to notice videos of the United States government physically attacking people born in the country of the residential IP address.

The TikTok algorithm in South America. Content about Tiananmen Square and Tibet gets filtered out. Content about the United States government rolling through protesters in armored vehicles, killing people in Venezuela with bombs, and threatening Greenland, straight to top of feed.

The most brutally honest propaganda is always the most effective propaganda.

> Content about Tiananmen Square and Tibet gets filtered out. Content about the United States government rolling through protesters in armored vehicles, killing people in Venezuela with bombs, and threatening Greenland, straight to top of feed.

There's also the degree of relevance. Tiananmen was over a quarter of a century ago. The USA is killing protestors, bombing Venezuela, threatening Greenland now.

Does China go around the world invading countries in the name of freedom?

> Content about the United States government rolling through protesters in armored vehicles, killing people in Venezuela with bombs, and threatening Greenland, straight to top of feed.

None of this is propaganda, it's just facts.

You don’t think that there could be purely organic reasons why content showing US hypocricy might be immensely popular in South America?
On mastodon, with the non-algorithmic feed, following mostly accounts that aren’t particularly political, those things are still at the top of the feed. If you’re not seeing those topics at the top of your feed you’re probably being misled by your algorithm.

Another reason why feed ranking algorithms should be published. If we can see the algorithm we can stop playing these yes/no games. The real enemies are social media companies, not the other side of politics.

> Content about the United States government rolling through protesters in armored vehicles, killing people in Venezuela with bombs, and threatening Greenland, straight to top of feed.

Aren't these recent events? A better example would be showing US atrocities from the last 50 years, but not Chinese.

Or hiding the suffering of Ukranian and Iranian peoples.

>It isn't so much as the rest of the world having easy access. It is what the Chinese want the rest of the world to see.

If your prosperity depends on using technocracy to deny 1.3 billion people the ability to communicate and share ideas with your citizens, a few things are true:

1) You have created a digital iron curtain

2) You are doomed because information wants to be free

3) If you succeed the result will be war, the only thing left when communication breaks down

I see people saying this a lot, but I've also seen videos demonstrating that you can easily post and search for Tiananmen Square content. I don't use Tiktok myself but it seems like this is basically untrue.
I'm confused. I thought there was Douyin in China and TikTok for the rest of the world. TikTok used to be under Chinese control but now is essentially under US control. Isn't western TikTok a single entity?
> the United States government rolling through protesters in armored vehicles

I'm sorry, did I miss something? Is this something that's happened (ever)?

I think the more concerning thing here is the US government attacking people of different ethnicities.
That's some very obtuse thinking.

The US has been applying soft power and hard power in South America - to put it euphemistically, as the most recent US intervention was just days ago - for close to a century. The Chinese... haven't.

Why should people in South America give a shit about Tiananmen or Tibet and at the same time not give a shit about the escalating authoritarian grip of the US regime, which is infinitely more relevant to their lives?

The U.S. government has not publicly presented any concrete evidence showing that TikTok has actually been used to influence US public opinion in line with CCP policy.
TikTok US it no longer controlled by the Chinese.
Using whataboutism doesn't negate the fact that the first amendment is being trampled over by the US administration.

Buying TikTok to censor it is the move of a fascist government.

Oh bullshit it’s entirely about controlling narratives around Israel, and now that they owe Trump it’s about censoring any opposition as well.

The TikTok ban was always an egregious attack on free speech.

We should let people know how bad politicians are. If everyone knows every time a politician is a mass murderer, it might provide an incentive for politicians to stop mass murdering people.
> the rest of the world have easy access to.

Except for China, where TikTok is nothing like the TikTok for the rest of the world

Which used to be seen as "Ew, China has their own version? Crazy censorship" but after some time it seems like the US is aiming for the very same thing. Classy.
TikTok is different in China, but the rest of the world isn’t getting a completely free TikTok.

TikTok is known for tipping the scales on political keywords everywhere. In the past they haven’t outright censored because that’s too obvious, but uploading videos on the wrong side (according to TikTok, of course) of a political topic will result in very few views.

I wouldn’t be surprised if as part of the transition they’re struggling with the previous methods of simply burying topics, so the obvious ban was their intermediate step.

The comments claiming this is specific to the US are simply wrong. TikTok has always done this everywhere.

A bunch of people around the world used 小红书 for months when they were worried about a twitter ban.

They got the same version of the app that people in China got. I haven't seen any formal studies but my impression, at the time, was that Chinese people were far better informed about the US than Americans were about China.

Which is basically what the US also wants.
People in China know. Believe me they know.
Do you think anti-ICE videos are being blocked in China?
At least the Chinese are not pretending to be a free democracy.
This information is all over American social media... Even the article references that Megan Stalter posted her videos on Instagram.
A lot of American propaganda hasn't been about strict censorship (as in making it strictly impossible to find out about things). It's about shifting the narrative enough. Most people have been made lazy enough to the point they don't read anything, certainly not fringe opinions. As long as people get their Mcdonalds, Soda and TV they won't do much.

I don't think the original intent of the tiktok sale was about censorship as much as it was about the chinese not allowing american platforms in china. Doesn't change that they're trying to use it to its 'fullest'.

Just because the information is out there doesn’t mean it’s where people are looking. You see this based on the news people watch where things they don’t cover might as well not exist. Which has always been true but it’s especially true today.
By preventing uploads, they are preventing the world from gaining access, not just the US public.
No, the rest of the world operates on different servers now.
I've never in my life used TikTok. Can you please point to a specific article, news source, journal, any piece of information that is legal in the United States that I don't have easy access to so I can see what I'm missing?
It's not about legality, its about scrolling and recommendations. Young people see stuff by other young people by default.

Its been a conservative/zionist talking point for years now that "the youth are getting brainwashed by tiktok", and Ellison in particular seems to be in the "I've gone hard right due to the latest Israel conflict" camp. So of course they're not being subtle about it.

You have easy access in that you can find things if you look for it.

What that commenter means by easy access is that the information is in mainstream sources pushed to people such that you are likely to know about it without having looked.

For example I made a comment here on HN recently that immigrants commit crimes at fewer rates than US born people. That sends a segment of Americans into a flying rage even though they have access to that information, they were never going to hear it in their ordinary channels, even if they stick to "mainstream" media.

I've never in my life used TikTok. Can you please point to a specific article, news source, journal, any piece of information that is legal in the United States that I don't have easy access to so I can see what I'm missing?

Whataboutism. You presumably know full well what the parent was describing, but if not:

TikTok presents users with feeds of videos. For many users, this is their primary news source.

An American oligarch and party loyalist now has de facto control of the app. Therefore, the regime has the capability to shape the narrative by boosting or hiding videos from the feed (whether or not they are doing so is an open question).

Could users still hypothetically find the same information elsewhere? Sure. But if this app is their primary source of information, would they even know they should bother doing so?

> that most people in the rest of the world have easy access to

The information is everywhere. Visit any news site, open any general social media feed, turn on any TV. We’re discussing it right now in the front page of HN!

Everyone in the US has easy access to the same information. Acting like only the rest of the world has easy access to this information is ridiculous.

The TikTok ban is the hammer, antitrust is the anvil.

Without antitrust regulation, TikTok would have been sold to Meta, and that would be it. We'd have an even worse monopoly (which is not a good thing), but at least we wouldn't have this. With such regulations present, the US government both forced a sale and disallowed a sale to anybody who they didn't like, basically forcing TikTok to choose a government-approved partner. What did that partner do to become government approved? We'll never know.

Antitrust in the US (and GDPR in Europe) give regulators wide latitude over who to prosecute and for what. This makes it much easier to do under-the-table deals to achieve objectives that you can't or don't want to achieve by regulation, like restricting free speech.

Subjecting companies to such regulation was ok when it was about transporting cattle or selling bricks, but giving governments the ability to regulate companies that have a wide impact on speech, even if the regulations don't seem to have anything to do with speech, is just asking for trouble.

I wonder where all the TikTok videos are about all the tanks and hotel shoot outs in Beijing over the last week or so are… where various party factions fought it out over control of the central committee and you have the disappearance of various generals in the PLA.
tiktok always censored, it's just now it censors anti-Trump content instead of anti-CCP content [1]

both are bad, I liked when tiktok was supposed to be just "banned". it's always been a tool for repressive governments

[1] https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-28/tiktok-huawei-surveil...

tech bros voted for this.
> The forced US hosted tik-tok sale is all about hiding information from the US public that most people in the rest of the world have easy access to.

No, at least during the Biden administration when the law was passed, it wasn't.

This shit is a lot more complicated that a hot take based on today's news.

Not really. It was about preventing CCP control of information.
You have no evidence that this is true and it sounds like a para kid conspiracy theory from the depths of the worst subreddits. Stop being silly.
Of course, because TikTok is the only way people in the US can access information.
>is all about hiding information from the US public that most people in the rest of the world have easy access to.

Are we talking about the Trump administration or the Biden administration? The current ban was passed under Biden with supermajorities in both houses.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efforts_to_ban_TikTok_in_the_U...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protecting_Americans_from_Fore...

> hiding information from the US public

It is literally on the front page of news papers....

Also, you can see it on Instagram, X, etc.

Even a cursory search on TikTok reveals anti-ICE content...