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There's a well run diner here beside the courts and because they have booths which are a little more private than tables it's always full of lawyers with clients or architects with builders that need space to lay out plans. It's always some professionals utilizing the whole table. Many armed sheriffs too so there is always security. It's run like a Michelin star restaurant the second you are out of water someone is there to refill. You will never come in and not be acknowledged immediately no matter how busy inside the staff have magical training to be able to multitask. There is tight windows for court staff they have to return on time and can't be waiting around trying to pay a bill with no staff in sight.
Beside it is a row of various hyper trendy restaurants that I never see similar patrons inside because they have terrible service and seating. The worst of them requires you to stand in a huge line and prepay then they bring the food out to you. This means watching idiot after idiot fumbling around with their phone or taking forever to find their card to pay while you stand in this line and burn up your lunch time. The clientele here is much different it's mostly tourists so is dead in the off season as no locals go.
I'm always interested in seeing how service industry runs things and it's usually just doing the basics better than everyone else that makes all the difference
Im convinced that real estate costs are whats confining restaurants to more confined service. In lower cost areas booths seem to be much more common.
One of my hobbies is looking up old prices in the BLS CPI calculator to see what they would cost today (March 2026 is the latest data.)
The June 1940 photograph along Hwy 1 in Maryland had $0.05 hotdogs ($1.17) and $0.10 burgers ($2.34).
The Feb 1959 photograph from the NYC diner advertises a $0.45 burger ($5.14) and probably a $0.75 steak sandwich ($8.57)
I wonder if portion size is comparable.
We may have inflation in more than one sense: prices have gone up, and perhaps the size of burgers and hot dogs have also increased.
No doubt I can find portion size clues if I look around. Haven't done so yet.
One neat inflation calculation I stumbled on is that inflation since 1945 to today is ~20x, so, from the film-noir era to today,
5¢ = $1
25¢ = $5
$1 = $20
$5 = $100
These prices adjusted for today's value seem off though. I'm guessing you'd be hard pressed to find a diner burger for $5.14 anywhere. No, fast food joints are not the same here and not part of this discussion.
Where is the discrepancy? I've never really trusted these "adjusted for inflation" type numbers. I'm not an economist so I have no idea how they are calculated, but they've always just felt off to me. Usually, the numbers are for something esoteric to me, but these are about something I have some familiarity. In my experience, the adjusted burger price is about half the actual cost of today.
> $0.05 hotdogs ($1.17)
Costco not that far off.
NJ got snubbed in this submission. We still have tons of independent diners (around 450 according to this article: https://www.npr.org/2024/04/01/1241959475/new-jersey-diners-... )
Yeah, it's weird, NJ is pretty well-known for having iconic Diners. People from many different states will know about NJ diners.
https://www.tastingtable.com/1203923/best-diners-in-new-jers...
And a number of restaurants that might as well be diners, but they're just a tad fancier.
I'm thinking of the Chatterbox in Ocean City, NJ, for instance. Grace Kelly used to be a waitress.
I took a visitor from Finland to a Jim's location in Austin, and they were in awe. "It's just like from the movies!" (because it was - it has been used several times as a filming location).
If you have a classic diner in your town, take your foreign guests there for the experience.
Looks like they have them in Helsinki:
> https://maps.app.goo.gl/NCiZgiRjGckp6Jzn6
And if that doesn't appeal, there's another one: https://maps.app.goo.gl/e3ZWtXWEKPvDnded8
Something you've got to realize is that this form of culture is something that has gone far beyond America's borders. To the European, it is the very pinnacle of "American Food" -- and 50s/60s themed diners are all over the place.
From Belgrade, Serbia: https://share.google/qGq9vC7tKgf0ISyLz
To out-of-the-way towns in Austria: https://maps.app.goo.gl/bzHfTAobTRkHpvAN9
Germany's chock full of them. (The Germans are also more obsessed with "Cowboys and Indians" and Western US culture than any nation I've ever seen.)
France has multiple "American Diner" chains e.g.: https://www.happydaysdiner.com/
I'd hazard that there are nearly as many of these restaurants outside the US as there are inside of it. Within the US it's "throwback/nostalgia." Outside the US it's "exotic/kitsch."
Maybe your Finnish friend was remarking that the American version somehow felt more "real"? I don't know... I've been to all sorts, and the ones in Europe are truly very similar.
Jim's is legit amazing. I end up going very rarely but every time I do it's been a perfect diner experience.
I tried their liver and onions (an aquired taste it turns out I don't really have) and a slice of some meregiune pie and idk, it really transported me, the food is always very real tasting, it's hard to isolate what it is that makes so much food taste manufactured now.
It's like Donns Depot, places that connect us to some wholesome parts in our shared history.
I recently visited my brother in Spokane (we're British, he moved out there a few years ago) and we went to Frank's Diner, still in it's original 1906 railcar. Not my first diner experience, but by far my favourite. Diners are probably my favourite part of American culinary culture.
Also, on my first visit to San Francisco, my mum and I stayed opposite the Pinecrest Diner on the edge of the Tenderloin. Being jetlagged, I woke up at 5am the first morning and went there just as it opened, and having my coffee and huge breakfast as various diner regulars stopped by was just fantastic.
I was really sad to learn recently an old diner I went to often in Venice Beach (Cafe' 50'S, on Lincoln and Lake) burned at some point and the building is just an empty husk now.
That place was great cheap food.
> Not all diners look like train cars, but many do because they were fabricated to look that way, […] features a corrugated metal surface
Article would do well to mention that this particular style comes from cars manufactured by Budd Company, who developed the necessary process of welding the stainless steel, first seen on Burlington's “Zephyr”:
Don't know about "classic". But diners used to be my weekly jaunt here in South Bay for almost a decade. Not any more because with age you realize the quantity is too much and my drive to work changed (WFH). There's something special about going to your regular place, seeing the same servers, and them knowing your order before you say it. Probably the same in dinner restaurants but we don't repeat restaurants as often whereas the breakfast / lunch diner was weekly so very familiar (to both sides). Tried to switch places a couple of times just for experience but it never felt the same ... but you can make it work.
When I lived in NJ over 20 years ago, I'd stop by a random diner on the turnpike and order 2 sunny side up and a cup of coffee. Or a Greek place mid-town, a sloppy gyro. It wasn't ambrosia, but it was "perfectly cromulent" and the gritty surroundings added to the taste. I'd do the same in Brooklyn under a random industrial street in Bensonhurst or Sheepshead Bay. That era is just gone. I don't remember seeing an avocado on the menu back then.
>...the quantity is too much...
Leftovers for a later meal. Unless there is something about work involved and not having a place to put the leftovers in the fridge.
which one(s) in South Bay? any recommendations?
I love diners but they aren't affordable anymore! I want a cheap simple meal and bad coffee. The diners that seem to survive in this market end up up-scaling their menus. : (
I desperately miss the 90's and the middle class we used to have. I also miss basic cheap eats. If someone tried to make an authentic type of diner today, it would immediately become swamped with influencers.
How can I get away from all this? Is there a town somewhere where everyone is over 45 and there is no cell service and a full meal is $5?
Heck I would settle for a small NorCal town that doesn't have gangs or meth.
Tastes have changed and I think people have been highly exposed to tastier dishes.
There's also the "Denny's" problem. Classic diners tend to be pretty much the same as a Denny's in terms of quality.
Waffle House is your jam.
Only in the southern US unfortunately
I suspect that people want a theoretical cheap, simple meal, but what makes things cheap now is less the simplicity of ingredients, but really lowering the labour effort. So, something like the free breakfast at a cheap motel: bulk egg mixture, sausages that might as well be 50% cardboard pulp, big tubs of factory waffle batter, churned out onto disposable plates. Unless that's exactly what you have in mind, of course!
I’ve got a place by me that does 2 eggs, 2 pancakes (or French toast), 2 sausages and toast for $4 before 8 AM.
And I don’t go there. The spots that get twice (or more) as much for that meal really are quite a bit better. And their coffee is truly foul. Classic diner coffee is fine, but if I’ve had better coffee on an airplane I’m not prone to going back.
IHOP and Denny's fit that. They're quiet about the value menu.
Especially today. I used to go to a place where every time I ate, my wife would roll her eyes as I talked about how good the prices were. Even they’re expensive now. Still cheaper, but damn. I don’t eat out nearly as much anymore. It’s sad. Diners are my favorite.
Visited Portland, Maine recently and ate at Becky’s Diner there. What a wonderful place, the food was just what you would expect when walking in (and I mean that in the best way).
It made me lament the lack of old school diners where I live. Sometimes you just need a perfectly cooked breakfast and some solid coffee!
I love diners. The late nights of undergrad was spent in diner booths, with textbooks and laptops splayed, and cups of coffee that never ran dry.
New Mexico has lots of great dinners scattered all around the state. I'm in Massachusetts now and enjoying those I can find here.
I sometimes forget ford used to make cars more than trucks.
the prices in that article shows the diners were cheap enough for a working man to eat daily there - a 10c dinner in 1940 - would be $2.38 today.
you can't find a hot meal for $2.30 anywhere in the states or Western Europe today.
You can buy kits!
In SF/LA there's Mel's which has been around since 1947. Unfortunately I've had some pretty bad meals there (the one a across from the Metreon). In SoCal there's also Ruby's. It not "classic" (started in 1982), but their original location is on the Balboa Pier which is pretty great (https://maps.app.goo.gl/WoWrLEmGwPbVaumq5)
If you want to dine in an actual railcar, visit the Old Spaghetti Factory!
https://franksdiners.com
just looking at the video makes me hungry.
It feels weird that you sit on a counter and face the staff while you eat or drink (while do their job).
Worcester, MA has several classic old diners still. Some used to be manufactured there, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worcester_Lunch_Car_Company
I did a lot of research in to the evolution of US fast food culture recently, from a technology angle. If anyone would be interested in a run-down I might put together a video starting ~19th century and moving to present.
I think "diner" should be a protected term that has to meet certain criteria, like Kentucky Strait Bourbon.
A diner should only be able to legally call itself a diner if it's open 24/7, has a glass case showing slices of its desserts, offers breakfast, lunch and dinner all day, and if you order spaghetti, your server yells back to the kitchen for "a mile of rope".
Oh nice. I remember miss bellows falls from growing up!
I like reading about these classic food cultures. It's fascinating how some traditions stay the same for decades
The lack and white photo “row of truck drivers sitting at a Maryland diner counter” has an amazing sense of place.
Not a single picture of a diner in Worcester, MA? For shame.
No mention of New Jersey, sacrilege.
if you ever visit Austin do try Kerby Lane Cafe/Magnolia Cafe.
I would be frequenting the diner I pass by every day on the way home, but for some reason they think it's good business to stop serving eggs after the morning. To me, a proper diner should keep the griddle on and be serving eggs any time of the day.
Why is this boosted to the front page?
The photos does not display what I hate the most: the fixed 2 double seats tables. It is completely antisocial.
You can't arrive with your group of six friends and "join tables" so everybody can seat together. What Americans have against a big group of friends?