Item — HN Reader

I'm tired of this shit. I'm tired of these people getting more attention than they deserve over inane PC-BULLSHIT.

So she quit because at an after-party, where the vast majority of attendees were men, there were exotic dancers? Apparently I should be in a hissy-fit where I work because every other Friday my company has a ladies-night and the VP (who is a woman) and the other ladies that work here go out to have fun as a group.

Next story, please. I'm tired of this crap, I'm tired of reading about it, and I'm tired of people fawning over it.

Edit: This will probably be the last time I comment on these type of posts. I'm just going to flag them moving forward as they are against HN TOS with no political posts being allowed.

4 comments

IGDA agrees with her and apologized. A real apology, not "we're sorry you feel that way". Also it wasn't an after party, it was an actual industry event sponsored by YetiZen.

Edit: oh and she just got the lifetime achievement award for promoting women in gaming! https://twitter.com/br/status/317385016286003200 She's not just whining and throwing a fit; she has more perspective on this than you do.

So she quit because at an after-party, where the vast majority of attendees were men, there were exotic dancers?

Wow, So is your idea that when there are mostly men at an event, exotic dancers will just naturally follow? Is your idea that events with mostly men are natural too, rather than being a result of, say, the lack of women in the industry?

"All group X" parties don't seem terribly threatening if group X happens to be under-represented and under-empowered in an organization. Similar parties are very threatening in the opposite situation. Consider a "white people's night out" in a company with lower minority representation - that would be a very bad thing (legal, morally and for company morale). Yeah, events for over-represented-group to get together and do things that might make under-represented-group annoyed are problematic. They send a message to a person in the under-represented group even if that person doesn't have problem with the activity per se.

Edit: Double wow, your wasn't top-voted when I started my reply.

Oh yeah, this looks really inappropriate and sexist! Pffff.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/carolpinchefsky/2013/03/27/reall...

Can read you your link: "To explain the problem with female dancers at an industry party is that these women are on display. Even if they were dancing in a PG-13 manner, they’re still detracting from the purpose of the event: a professional gathering."

Which is what I say in the post you're replying to.

[Edited to remove reference to original parent.]

Toxic comments are a bigger problem than inappropriate posts. The latter can always be killed or flagged, whereas toxic comments poison the bloodstream of the site. They're the opposite of the civility that HN's guidelines call for.

Too many of us treat HN as a dumping ground for personal anger. (I say "us" because I've not been immune to this myself.) One should try not to, and if that's hard, one should try harder.

Fair enough, I've removed the first line; I agree it was a toxic comment. I just felt the need to vent.

I'm not sure "I'm tired of this shit" puts you quite in the clear, but the general direction is commendable :)

Now that I WON'T remove. I am tired of this shit.

I'm tired of THIS shit.

I'm tired of unprofessional activities like this being ok, because FOR THE MENZ. Because we have "a very special culture". Because the 'intent' was pure (because intent is MAGIC).

I'm tired of having to fight to have my technical skills recognised on an equal footing as men. I'm tired of my baseline pay offerings before negotiation being less, even after accounting for the difference in perceived skill level. [1]

I'm tired of women being perceived as dominating discussions when they are only providing a third of the input [2]

I'm tired of the issue of women being less able to speak is swept under the carpet by the very group of people that repeatedly (like right here) re-enforce this, and then go and blame the victim! [3]

Which, if you haven't noticed, is exactly what is happening here.

Inappropriate entertainment for a professional space is laid on. Women present and directly affected by this sort of thing [4] complain publicly - and rightly so. If you are supposed to be representing the women within an organisation that has done this, your damage control actions are pretty much limited to quit and disavow all involvement. There is no other safe way to recover from the destruction of trust just caused. This is the same throughout business, unless you are so well entrenched that trust is a moot issue, or you really are the only person who could possibly see it right again.

I'm not going to go into all the other reasons why this entertainment was completely messed up, and I shouldn't even have to.

This stuff belongs on hacker news, because we don't live in a world of just finances and code. Because hackers should question their own assumptions and prejudices. Because a company that pisses off 50% of clients and employees needlessly is stupid [5], and understanding how people interact is utterly fascinating and extremely useful.

[1] http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/unofficial-prognosis/201...

[2] http://people.ucalgary.ca/~qinli/publication/ajet_cmc_harass...

[3] http://jezebel.com/5944642/women-speak-75-less-when-theyre-s...

[4] http://blog.katylevinson.com/booth-babes-street-clothes-and-...

[5] Actually, the figure is much, much higher than that. Most men I know care about this, or at least care about their families.