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by dmitrygr·11y ago·view on hn ↗
Refuse to talk to cops (always, not just about jaywalking).

Do not provide ID ever (unless driving, since it also happens to be your DL) and do not answer questions as to whether you have ID.

The amount of paperwork they'll need to fill out in order to arrest you (and thus allow them to search you [the claim will be that the search is for weapons for their safety, but anything they find is free for them to use/look at, incl your ID, if you even have it]) makes it not worth it for them. They'll just find a stupider victim.

Disclaimer: IANAL, but i do often end up in court with cops over a lot of things, this included, and have not yet paid any fines

4 comments
I applaud your courage to stand up to that but I don't know about following the advice after reading "i do often end up in court with cops over a lot of things, this included"... Confused.
I do the same to protest stupid laws.
This isn't really an endorsement though is it. IANAL and I'm not often in court with cops and I say cooperate they're people too. shrugs
In my experience, American cops are indeed 100% people, but a significant proportion are not good people. The worst, most vicious people I knew from high school became policemen. There are no standards. The police admit any ol' gun-fetishist idiot who wants to beat up "hippies and negroes". It barely even matters if he can hold a gun straight, because there are no standards and no accountability.
I agree with grandfather here. Do not cooperate with law enforcement when you have an option. This does not mean be rude to them or try to be difficult. It just means that you have to assert your rights. Any cop who does not respect a person's rights does not, in my eyes, deserve cooperation.

Of course, almost everyone would love to help the police with their investigation as much as they can but in a litigious climate with plea bargaining (and not to even talk about the illegal quotas that officers need to meet), I am simply not convinced that there is enough incentive for law enforcement to get the right person.

Life is not CSI. Cops are people too. They want to go home at the end of the day. I am not saying all police officers are corrupt all the time. I am simply saying most of them are overworked (and perhaps underpaid) a lot. If you think about it from this perspective, I hope you'll agree that not asserting your rights and helping law enforcement is a terrible idea. There is a video on YouTube that talks about the same thing. If they tell you the investigation is not directed towards you, have them give you something in writing (make sure your lawyer reads it) that grants you a full and unconditional pardon. Of course, they will not grant it.

In case of jaywalking, I'd say the law is flawed. If the people who allocate resources for law enforcement think that it is enough of a problem, they should allocate enough resources to cover for people's right to refuse to identify themselves unless presented with a warrant.

In the same vein, I really wish that the monies from fines and tickets not go to the police or to the general treasury at all. I wish we treated such money as bad money. I don't know what we'd do with it but doing any good with bad money taints the good efforts and will eventually rot the effort. (E.g., civil forfeiture in the incredibly stupid war on drugs)

IANAL.

They're...people who want to point guns at you and steal your money? Why would anyone want to cooperate with people like that?
> Do not provide ID ever (unless driving, since it also happens to be your DL) and do not answer questions as to whether you have ID.

Isn't it technically illegal for an adult not to have ID on them?

There is no form of ID required to walk around in the US. If I am not driving I don't have to carry my DL.

If a police officer asks you to stop and what your name is, you ARE required to ID yourself in most states but not to prove it via ID.

> "Stop and identify" statutes are statute laws in the United States that authorize police[1] to legally obtain the identification of someone whom they reasonably suspect has committed a crime. If the person is not reasonably suspected of committing a crime, they are not required to provide identification, even in states with stop and identify statutes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes

EDIT: I found better documentation on this.

Some US states require ID.

> The person approached is not required to identify himself or answer any other questions, and may leave at any time

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes#Stat...

http://www.quora.com/In-the-US-under-what-situations-are-you... --old:

Depends. A quick google found this: http://www.flexyourrights.org/faqs/when-can-police-ask-for-i...

> As of 2013, 24 states had stop-and-identify laws. Regardless of your state’s law, keep in mind that police can never compel you to identify yourself without reasonable suspicion to believe you’re involved in illegal activity

No states require an ID card. Some states require you to provide ID information, and may detain you as long as necessary to determine your identidy. Thus detainment is often used as an unofficial punishment for not providing an ID card.
WARNING: If you are in IL you a required to state your name, DOB, and home address.
Only if cops have reason to believe you have committed or about to commit a crime. They are NOT allowed to lie about this suspicion if you ask them directly!